Pecard's help.

Pitfall Harry · Post by **Pitfall Harry** » Thu Mar 23, 2006 7:27 pm

I just wanted to know is the Pecard's Leather Dressing a clear lotion? I was wondering if it would change the color of my natural tan whip and also the effects it would have on my Dark Brown Wested.

Is it all right to use right after using saddle soap on a whip? And how do you guys apply it to your whip? Do you mostly use it on the middle and end of the whip?

I was going to order some online for my whip and I had to know what I was doing because I don't want to mess up my $400 whip.

Indiana Jerry · Post by **Indiana Jerry** » Thu Mar 23, 2006 8:15 pm

It's yellowish, but it doesn't seem to color the whip. I put it on w/ an old (but clean) rag.

(I notice a bit of color come out of my whip on the rag, but mine is a whiskey-tan IOAB, so results may vary on that point.)

Generally, I hear that you can (or should) pecard the fall after each use. Pecard the main body of the whip (thong) anywhere from a few times a year to monthly, I believe, based on how much use it gets and under what conditions. After you do it once, you'll be able to see the difference between your well-treated whip and what it looks like dry.

Most whips, I hear you shouldn't treat the handle or large knots, for fear of loosening them up too much. Just a light surface amount IF IT NEEDS IT. (On the IOAB this doesn't seem to be an issue, though.)

Okay, whipsters, how wrong did I get that?

(Harry, I'd wait for more answers to get a consensus before you go w/ my advice, in case I bungled something. But I believe that's it.)

J

Strider · Post by **Strider** » Thu Mar 23, 2006 9:50 pm

I don't think you got it wrong. I have just had to Pecard my whip a little more often lately, because I've either cracked it on pavement several times for friends (and saw the results), or it got wet.

ecwhips · Post by **ecwhips** » Thu Mar 23, 2006 10:18 pm

Strider wrote:I don't think you got it wrong. I have just had to Pecard my whip a little more often lately, because I've either cracked it on pavement several times for friends (and saw the results), or it got wet.

Pavement??? Cracking on pavement will get your whip taken away in certain parts of the country!

Actually, I cracked a kangaroo hide whip on pavement just to see how it would hold up. Outside of the scuffing, it really took the beating well, although I don't recommend it as regular practice.

Jim

Strider · Post by **Strider** » Thu Mar 23, 2006 11:59 pm

Yeah, I wouldn't be doing it often either. Even after I cracked it on the pavement, I used very very small smears of Pecards to cover up the scuff marks. I've only Pecarded the begeebers out of it once when it got really wet. As for cracking on pavement, my friend at 7-11 calls me up at like, 1 am (I'm a night owl), and goes: "Bring your whip down here, I want to see you use it!"

So, I brought it down and did some overhead cracks (the only one I can ever seem to get to work with any manner of consistancy

), and then we put it away behind the counter while I hung out and chatted with him awhile. About 20 minutes after we stopped, a cop showed up and asked us if we had "heard any gunshots". We just said: "No, officer. I'm sure if there had been gunshots, we'd have heard them." As soon as the officer drove off, my friend said: "He didn't say anything about whip cracks, though."

Pitfall Harry · Post by **Pitfall Harry** » Fri Mar 24, 2006 12:30 am

HA!

I got mine to crack a few times tonight. I'm really rusty using one right now. I need to read some directions on how to do the different cracks.

Post by **BullWhipBorton** » Fri Mar 24, 2006 1:08 am

Pecards classic leather dressing is a yellowish/clear dressing very similar to vaseline/petroleum jelly with a slightly thicker consistency due to the addition of bees wax. It will not really change the color of your whip, but it may assist in the natural darkening of natural tan leathers over time. Pecards is one of the better products to uses on a kangaroo hide whip so don’t worry. (I would use Pecards leather lotion on your Wested jacket. Depending on what leather your jacket is made from the classic leather dressing might not absorb properly and leave your jacket feeling greasy.)

Jerry gave you good advice. Don’t treat the plaited handles or the knots. A light wipe on, wipe off is ok just to give it a little shine, but don’t let it absorbed into the leather. You want to keep these areas on your whip tight and secure, so that the overlay on the handle doesn’t start to shift, or that the knots start to come loose over time. The natural oils in your hands will usually be enough to keep the handle treated and you can use a little shoe polish on the knots from time to time, to polish them up if you like.

When you use pecards, be sure the whip is clean and dry before you apply the leather dressing. If you chose to clean your whip with saddle soap first (which is ok) just give it a chance to dry if the leather gets a little damp, before you apply the dressing. Work it in to the thong with your hands or a clean soft cloth, allow it a chance to absorb and then wipe off any excess. Treating them every 6 months is a general recommendation for whips in storage or for the casual whip cracker; you just don’t want the leather to dry out. You can grease them more or less depending on how often the whip is being used and the conditions you’re working under. You may find that the last two or three feet of the plaited whip will need more dressing then the handle end of the whip as the belly acts as a reservoir for the oils in the whip. Pay particular attention towards the point where the whip is more likely to come contact with the ground and experiences more stress and sharp flexing as the whip rolls out and cracks. It is also best to keep your fall well greased at all times, after every practice session or two is a good rule of thumb. Its equally important not to over treats your whips either. A whip should not feel greasy after its been wiped clean.

Some leathers just naturally give off color, red hide for example is notorious for doing that, and you can rub with a dry cloth very easily so it just depends on the leather your whip is made from.

Cracking on pavement is not recommended, the hard rough texture will act as a server abrasive and will scrape them up something fierce. This is more of an issue with kangaroo hide whips where the strands are cut very thinly towards the point and not such a concern with the thicker cowhide whips. Cracking on pavement however can also be dangerous to the whip handler as other whip handlers who observe this will certainly scold you and probably throw things at you. This can make for lively target practice.

Dan

Strider · Post by **Strider** » Fri Mar 24, 2006 8:29 am

I pecarded my whip after it had gotten wet before it dried, because I read on a buried thread here that you didn't want to let the thing dry out before applying pecards. I've done that a few times. Is this a bad thing?
Sometimes I go out, the grass is wet, and before I realize that fact, the thong of my whip is all wet. Is this a bad thing?

My whip has darkened because of the use of Pecards, but then, I have brown pecards, not the clear stuff.

Pitfall Harry · Post by **Pitfall Harry** » Fri Mar 24, 2006 11:17 am

What about buying regular Beeswax? I think there maybe a few places here in town that I can buy Fiebing's Leather Conditioner with Beeswax. Has anyone ever used that?

If I can get this stuff here in town instead of buying the Pecard's and waiting for it in the mail I would rather do that. I want to be able to start practicing with my whip and not have to worry about not being able to take care of it right after I use it.

Post by **Michaelson** » Fri Mar 24, 2006 11:22 am

Since Pecards is made in Wisconsin, I would think you'd have your dressing within a day if you ordered directly from the factory.

Regards! Michaelson

winrichwhips · Post by **winrichwhips** » Fri Mar 24, 2006 12:53 pm

Strider,

I always let my whips dry out before putting Pecards on them. The way I look at it, the Pecards isn't going to soak into the whip if the water is in the way, taking up the space where the Pecards should go.

-Adam

PS: anybody notice my avatar? It's Stephen Colbert, but looking at it now, maybe it's a little too politicized for this forum.

Indiana Jerry · Post by **Indiana Jerry** » Fri Mar 24, 2006 1:08 pm

See, I thought it was that guy from Animal House...

I cracked my whip on my cement driveway once at Halloween...ONCE. I tried to keep it airborne, but that's impossible...took a look at all the scuffs after just one crack and figured that was already something I'd have to atone for, and put it back on my hip.

Afterthought on the color loss...it's also possible that since I had not really CLEANED my whip before I pecarded it, I was actually loosening up dust, dirt, and grime, and that's part of what was coming off...hmm...

Pitfall Harry · Post by **Pitfall Harry** » Fri Mar 24, 2006 1:24 pm

BullWhipBorton wrote:Pecards classic leather dressing is a yellowish/clear dressing very similar to vaseline/petroleum jelly with a slightly thicker consistency due to the addition of bees wax. It will not really change the color of your whip, but it may assist in the natural darkening of natural tan leathers over time. Pecards is one of the better products to uses on a kangaroo hide whip so don’t worry. (I would use Pecards leather lotion on your Wested jacket. Depending on what leather your jacket is made from the classic leather dressing might not absorb properly and leave your jacket feeling greasy.)

Jerry gave you good advice. Don’t treat the plaited handles or the knots. A light wipe on, wipe off is ok just to give it a little shine, but don’t let it absorbed into the leather. You want to keep these areas on your whip tight and secure, so that the overlay on the handle doesn’t start to shift, or that the knots start to come loose over time. The natural oils in your hands will usually be enough to keep the handle treated and you can use a little shoe polish on the knots from time to time, to polish them up if you like.

When you use pecards, be sure the whip is clean and dry before you apply the leather dressing. If you chose to clean your whip with saddle soap first (which is ok) just give it a chance to dry if the leather gets a little damp, before you apply the dressing. Work it in to the thong with your hands or a clean soft cloth, allow it a chance to absorb and then wipe off any excess. Treating them every 6 months is a general recommendation for whips in storage or for the casual whip cracker; you just don’t want the leather to dry out. You can grease them more or less depending on how often the whip is being used and the conditions you’re working under. You may find that the last two or three feet of the plaited whip will need more dressing then the handle end of the whip as the belly acts as a reservoir for the oils in the whip. Pay particular attention towards the point where the whip is more likely to come contact with the ground and experiences more stress and sharp flexing as the whip rolls out and cracks. It is also best to keep your fall well greased at all times, after every practice session or two is a good rule of thumb. Its equally important not to over treats your whips either. A whip should not feel greasy after its been wiped clean.

Some leathers just naturally give off color, red hide for example is notorious for doing that, and you can rub with a dry cloth very easily so it just depends on the leather your whip is made from.

Cracking on pavement is not recommended, the hard rough texture will act as a server abrasive and will scrape them up something fierce. This is more of an issue with kangaroo hide whips where the strands are cut very thinly towards the point and not such a concern with the thicker cowhide whips. Cracking on pavement however can also be dangerous to the whip handler as other whip handlers who observe this will certainly scold you and probably throw things at you. This can make for lively target practice.

Dan

Thanks for the tips.

My Wested is a Dark Goat. The Pecard's site only lists the Lamb jacket not for use with the Leather Dressing. I could be reading it wrong though.

Indiana Jerry · Post by **Indiana Jerry** » Fri Mar 24, 2006 2:09 pm

Pitfall Harry wrote:My Wested is a Dark Goat. The Pecard's site only lists the Lamb jacket not for use with the Leather Dressing. I could be reading it wrong though.

Nope, you got it right. You should be able to use the standard leather dressing on a goat. (Er, a goatskin jacket, anyway.)

It's only the lambskin that they really feel needs the leather lotion instead. (Just like it says on www.pecard.com)

J

Post by **BullWhipBorton** » Fri Mar 24, 2006 4:30 pm

You don’t really want to put leather dressing on a wet whip if you can avoid it. The grease can trap the moisture in the leather for longer periods as well as keep the dressing from absorbing properly, and cause it to take longer to actually soak in. If you have done it a few times, I wouldn’t worry about it, however; it’s just not something you should repeat over time. Brown pecards? Is that their weatherproof dressing that comes in different tints?

Fiebings Aussie leather dressing, which also contains bee’s wax is another great product to use on your whip. That’s the stuff Mark Allen recommends using and I know some of the folks here use it in place of pecards. If you can get that more easily, it would work just fine for your bullwhip.

Dan

Bufflehead Jones · Post by **Bufflehead Jones** » Fri Mar 24, 2006 5:00 pm

BullWhipBorton wrote: Brown pecards? Is that their weatherproof dressing that comes in different tints?

Yes. It is Pecards weatherproof shoe dressing. I wouldn't use it on a whip unless I intentionally wanted to darken the whip. I prefer to allow the whip to darken or change color on it's own. It is the same as the Pecards leather dressing, only with the tint added.

ecwhips · Post by **ecwhips** » Fri Mar 24, 2006 5:59 pm

winrichwhips wrote:
PS: anybody notice my avatar? It's Stephen Colbert, but looking at it now, maybe it's a little too politicized for this forum.

That's alright, Adam. I'll just put on my Rush Limbaugh avatar.

Jim

Strider · Post by **Strider** » Fri Mar 24, 2006 10:14 pm

winrichwhips wrote:Strider,

I always let my whips dry out before putting Pecards on them. The way I look at it, the Pecards isn't going to soak into the whip if the water is in the way, taking up the space where the Pecards should go.

Makes sense, but is it a bad thing that I've already done that a couple times?

Pitfall Harry · Post by **Pitfall Harry** » Fri Mar 24, 2006 11:28 pm

It doesn't sound to me like it is. I wouldn't do it anymore though. You wouldn't want the whip to come apart on you.

I'm going to see if I can find the Fiebing's Leather Conditioner here in town this weekend. If I don't then I'll order the Pecard's.

Thanks for all your help guys.

Bufflehead Jones · Post by **Bufflehead Jones** » Sat Mar 25, 2006 1:44 am

Hey Pitfall,

If you really want to find the product locally, you can get Pecards if there is a Red Wing Shoe store near you. They have a leather conditioner that is just Pecards with a Red Wing label on it. It comes in a tin, like shoe polish.

Pitfall Harry · Post by **Pitfall Harry** » Sat Mar 25, 2006 9:12 am

Bufflehead Jones wrote:Hey Pitfall,

If you really want to find the product locally, you can get Pecards if there is a Red Wing Shoe store near you. They have a leather conditioner that is just Pecards with a Red Wing label on it. It comes in a tin, like shoe polish.

I'll have to check and see if we do. Thanks.

Pitfall Harry · Post by **Pitfall Harry** » Tue Mar 28, 2006 12:41 am

Well...

It turns out we do have a Red Wings shoe store here in old "Fort Fun". I went there today and started looking for the leather conditioner. The sales people asked me if I needed help. They pointed me to their All Natural Leather Dressing. It's says it's a "Natural blend of Pine Pitch , Mink Oil and Beeswax" It looks exactly like how the Pecard's Classic dressing is described.

It also says it conditions and preserves leather while providing excellent water repellence and may darken lighter colored leather.

So did I buy the right stuff? I want to make sure before I start using it on my whip.

Bufflehead Jones · Post by **Bufflehead Jones** » Tue Mar 28, 2006 3:06 am

Pecards definitely has beeswax in it. But, mink oil and pine pitch doesn't sound right.

I saw Pecards at Red Wing Shoes quite awhile ago, and others talked about the Red Wing leather conditioner being made by Pecards. I can't seem to find the post with that discussion right now (where is VP when you need him). It has been long enough since I saw the product that they could have changed their supplier by now. I certainly hope not.

It didn't say that on it when I saw it. I was trying to help you find some Pecards without ordering it, as that seems to be what you wanted. I certainly hope that I haven't mislead you.

Does anyone else know if this sounds like it is still made by Pecards? I believe mink oil is one of the things that we don't want to put on our leather.

Pitfall Harry · Post by **Pitfall Harry** » Tue Mar 28, 2006 10:07 am

Bufflehead Jones wrote:
Does anyone else know if this sounds like it is still made by Pecards? I believe mink oil is one of the things that we don't want to put on our leather.

Yeah, that's what through me off too. I've read several different sites that said something about avoiding mink oil for use on a whip.

I got on the Pecard's website last night and they list Red Wing Shoes as someone they have supplied before.

The description of their leather dressing that everyone uses on here does say something about sealing the leather against rain or snow. So that had me thinking that maybe I do have the right stuff.

I appreciate all the help from everyone. I may end up though just taking this stuff back to the store and ordering the Pecard's straight from the site. Atleast I know then I'm getting the right stuff that everyone else uses. I'd hate to use something that may mess up a $400 whip!!

VP · Post by VP » Tue Mar 28, 2006 10:17 am

Bufflehead Jones wrote:(where is VP when you need him)

At school.

viewtopic.php?p=181278#181278
viewtopic.php?p=57779#57779

Pitfall Harry · Post by **Pitfall Harry** » Tue Mar 28, 2006 12:40 pm

Well, I just ended up ordering a 6oz bottle of Pecard's Leather Dressing.

I think I did buy the wrong stuff at Red Wing Shoes and I'm going to return it. I also think I may have had the right stuff in my hand the first time but was told wrong by the sales person.

Oh, well.....At least now I know I've got the right stuff and after all I guess waiting a little isn't so bad.

Bufflehead Jones · Post by **Bufflehead Jones** » Tue Mar 28, 2006 2:32 pm

Pitfall,

I think you made the right decision. It really doesn't take that long to get some Pecards. From what you say, it sounds like Red Wing shoes still has Pecards with a Red Wing label on it, it's just the sales staff is unaware who makes it. You will probably be able to tell, once you see some Pecards. I am gald that I didn't totally mess you up.

Bufflehead Jones · Post by **Bufflehead Jones** » Tue Mar 28, 2006 2:34 pm

Oh, I forgot. Thanks, VP. I tried to do a search and was unable to find those threads.

Pitfall Harry · Post by **Pitfall Harry** » Tue Mar 28, 2006 5:17 pm

Bufflehead Jones wrote:Pitfall,

I think you made the right decision. It really doesn't take that long to get some Pecards. From what you say, it sounds like Red Wing shoes still has Pecards with a Red Wing label on it, it's just the sales staff is unaware who makes it. You will probably be able to tell, once you see some Pecards. I am gald that I didn't totally mess you up.

Yeah, I just got back from returning that stuff. I kind of looked at the other stuff I had in my hand before I bought the dressing and that might have been the "Pecard's" but it didn't have any ingredients listed on the plastic jar it was in. It just said Red Wing Leather Conditioner.

Like you said at least now I will know what I'm looking for and it will be nice to have the Pecard's direct from the factory.

Post by **BullWhipBorton** » Thu Mar 30, 2006 1:56 am

Glad you returned the other stuff. Hopefully your order from Pecard’s should arrive in a few days and this way you know your getting the good stuff.

You are better off if you avoid using mink oil, or products that contain mink oil on a whip as it can go funky after a while and can attract vermin such as mice and insects which may decide that your whip tastes good. Pecards manufacturers Red Wings shoes #95140 leather conditioner. But I am not sure if this is the same stuff as Pecards classic leather dressing.

Dan

Pitfall Harry · Post by **Pitfall Harry** » Thu Mar 30, 2006 2:26 am

BullWhipBorton wrote:Glad you returned the other stuff. Hopefully your order from Pecard’s should arrive in a few days and this way you know your getting the good stuff.

You are better off if you avoid using mink oil, or products that contain mink oil on a whip as it can go funky after a while and can attract vermin such as mice and insects which may decide that your whip tastes good. Pecards manufacturers Red Wings shoes #95140 leather conditioner. But I am not sure if this is the same stuff as Pecards classic leather dressing.

Dan

Yeah, I'm almost certain the Red Wings shoes #95140 leather conditioner was what I had in my hands before I bought the other stuff that I ended up returning.

I think I made the right move. The last thing I need is vermin and insects attacking my whip.

By the way you wouldn't believe the look I got when I told the salesperson what I was using it for. I said that my wife got me a bullwhip for my birthday and I got a look from this salesperson like I was some kind of S&M freak! I didn't even try to explain any further. They just suggested the other stuff and I bought it because it said it had Beeswax in it. I wasn't even aware until I got home that it also said Mink Oil.

Pitfall Harry · Post by **Pitfall Harry** » Thu Mar 30, 2006 3:08 pm

I just got my stuff in the mail today. I plan on using it tonight. Man, the Pecard's did get here quicker then I thought!

Post by **BullWhipBorton** » Sat Apr 01, 2006 3:04 am

By the way you wouldn't believe the look I got when I told the salesperson what I was using it for. I said that my wife got me a bullwhip for my birthday and I got a look from this salesperson like I was some kind of S&M freak!

Ha ha, I know that look all too well; people do tend to raise and eyebrow when you mention a whip!

Dan

Pitfall Harry · Post by **Pitfall Harry** » Sun Apr 02, 2006 11:16 am

Why do people always assume it's for something kinky? This country....

Anyway...

I had another question about the Pecard's. I just used some last night on my whip and I'm letting it soak in. I was debating on using some of the leather dressing on my Dark Brown Goatskin Wested. If I do how should I apply it? With a soft cloth or something else? And how long should I leave the stuff on there? I didn't know if I should leave it sit for a few days or let it sit for a little bit and then wipe it off that day.

Like I said I'm just thinking about it. The jacket is softening up quite nicely on it's own and I treated it not to long ago with leather conditioner so maybe it would be a waste of time.

Kt Templar · Post by **Kt Templar** » Sun Apr 02, 2006 11:32 am

Pitfall Harry wrote:Why do people always assume it's for something kinky? This country....

Not necessarily just in the US or in a bad way; the young ladies in my company all seemed to 'glow' a little when my whip was delivered.

Kt.