Which hat holds the LC Bash best...

In-depth discussion of the Fedora of Indiana Jones and all other hats appearing in the Indiana Jones movies

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Walden
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Which hat holds the LC Bash best...

Post by Walden »

I've always been a big fan of the LC bash as opposed to the ROTLA bash. Don't get me wrong, I like the raiders bash plenty, but the LC bash is definitely the one I like best.

That said, which had hold the LC Bash the best?

I'm currently tossing between the AFD and the AB.

I know previously I stated I was going with an AB, but judicious use of the search function here as introduced several more variables for me to consider :oops: . Unfortunately, this process is more complicated than I thought.

So, does the AFD or the AB hold the LC bash better? Price isn't a concern here, but I will be getting one hat at a time lest my wife kick me in the head :shock: , so I want to be sure to get the right one for my style at first.

That said, I've heard overwhelmingly positive things about both the AFD and AB, but I've still got some issues to work out. My Concerns:

1. I've owned various akubra's for a long time, so I know how to care for them, etc. I also know they can be stiff as ####, so I'm guessing from experience the AFD will be the same. Will it gradually soften as my other akubra hats have? From the pics on here I've seen, it doesn't present a particularly good ROTLA bash, so will it hold a good LC Bash?
2. Is the AB made specifically with the Raiders bash in mind?


I've got probably a dozen more questions but i'll save those for future search function forays and ontopic posts :wink:

Cheers!
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Post by Michaelson »

Of the ones I own (and I'm an LC fan myself), the AB and Peters Bros Borsalino (PBBM) hold the best LC bash out there, followed closely by the Akubra Fed Deluxe.

The Deluxe will indeed soften up like your other Akubras. The AB is aimed at the Raiders block, but can be LC blocked just as well. Steve's made me several over the years with no problems.

Regards! Michaelson
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Post by Modern Jones »

Hey Michaelson!

Could you post some recent pics of the hats in your stable? I remember when Steve wrangled your LC block for you. I'd be nice to see them together.


MJ
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Post by Michaelson »

If ever get around to posting all the photos I've promised to post, I'll be off line for a month just trying to get caught up. #-o :lol: :wink:

I'll sure try, my friend. I'm making NO promises....but I'll try.

Regards! Michaelson
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Post by Fedora »

So, does the AFD or the AB hold the LC bash better? Price isn't a concern here, but I will be getting one hat at a time lest my wife kick me in the head , so I want to be sure to get the right one for my style at first.

That said, I've heard overwhelmingly positive things about both the AFD and AB, but I've still got some issues to work out. My Concerns:

1. I've owned various akubra's for a long time, so I know how to care for them, etc. I also know they can be stiff as ####, so I'm guessing from experience the AFD will be the same. Will it gradually soften as my other akubra hats have? From the pics on here I've seen, it doesn't present a particularly good ROTLA bash, so will it hold a good LC Bash?
2. Is the AB made specifically with the Raiders bash in mind?
I have owned literally a score of the Akubra Federation. In fact, I just made one of my hats for one brother, while this guy's brother ordered a Deluxe Fed and had it sent to me to do the creases. It was a 7 3/8 size hat. Now, this particular Federation that I just creased, had the standard stiff brim, but the crown of the hat was decently soft. In fact, one of the softest Federations that I have seen from them, brand new. Generally the Feds soften up nicely with wear and weathering, in the crown area.

I personally feel that the LC HJ used a stiffer felt, as it just looks to be stiffer by how it creases out. And, I also think it(Akubra) makes for a great LC fedora, because I think it is fairly close to having the same characteristics of the LC film hat.


My own AB line can produce both looks, but lends itself to the Raiders fedora for two main reasons. One is the block shape that I use, and the other is my felt is not springy felt. You see two basic types of felt. One sort is springy, that is, if you push a dent in the side, it springs back out. The AB felt is the opposite. You push a small dent in the sides, and it stays. This non springy felt has always been my choice for the Raiders fedora.


In the end, if you are looking for a LC fedora, I highly recommend the Akubra Federation, or the Deluxe Federation. I also think I am one of a few that will steer folks to another brand of hat. I officially discontinued my rabbit line(although I break down occassionally and order a body for an Indy hat for folks who want a AB but cannot afford the beaver version, but want my block shape.


The LC felt, in my opinion, was more along the lines of most modern felt, while the Raiders version leaned toward the more traditonal vintage type of dress felt. Go for the Federation. When you get ready for a Raiders fedora, drop me or Marc a line. Both of our hats cater to the Raiders market. It is our passion, unlike other hatters who make hats for only the money. Fedora
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Post by Michaelson »

Makes sense why the PBBM holds the shape so well, as it is a modern rabbit felt. :-k

Regards! Michaelson
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Post by Hemingway Jones »

My Adventurebilt Gray Last Crusade hat has held the bash like iron. It nails the LC Venice Pier look.
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I cannot say enough good things about it. :wink: :D
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Post by Michaelson »

Yep, HJ, I'm not sure why Fedora is saying the AB lends itself more toward the Raiders bash. True, it's the perfect Raiders material, but he's ONLY made me LC versions all these years, and they've been perfect. I'm not going to debate the point with him....but he's great at creating this LC block, and I've told him so on MANY occasions. :-k

Regards! Michaelson
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Post by Hemingway Jones »

Michaelson wrote:Yep, HJ, I'm not sure why Fedora is saying the AB lends itself more toward the Raiders bash. True, it's the perfect Raiders material, but he's ONLY made me LC versions all these years, and they've been perfect. I'm not going to debate the point with him....but he's great at creating this LC block, and I've told him so on MANY occasions. :-k

Regards! Michaelson
I couldn't agree more. And it puts you and me in the uncomfortable position of arguing against Steve about his own product! :lol: :lol: :lol:
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Post by Michaelson »

Agreed. Let's go over to the corner and mumble between ourselves about this snafu...... 8) :lol: :wink:

Regards! Michaelson
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Post by Modern Jones »

Hemingway Jones wrote:My Adventurebilt Gray Last Crusade hat has held the bash like iron. It nails the LC Venice Pier look.
Image
I cannot say enough good things about it. :wink: :D
I forgot all about the new one you got HJ!!! That hat looks wonderful. How does it look on your noggin?

And Michaelson, how about I send some coffee your way for all the trouble? ;-)

Or you could just send me one of your hats ... er, um to "inspect".
(!POOF! - Modern Jones suddenly vanishes without a trace! ;-) )


MJ
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Post by Michaelson »

"Hey Ma...get the shovel...we got another one to bury out back!" 8) :wink:

Regards! Michaelson
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Post by Hemingway Jones »

Modern Jones wrote: I forgot all about the new one you got HJ!!! That hat looks wonderful. How does it look on your noggin?

MJ
And just when I was proud of myself for not posting a picture of myself. :wink: :lol:
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Post by Walden »


I have owned literally a score of the Akubra Federation. In fact, I just made one of my hats for one brother, while this guy's brother ordered a Deluxe Fed and had it sent to me to do the creases. It was a 7 3/8 size hat. Now, this particular Federation that I just creased, had the standard stiff brim, but the crown of the hat was decently soft. In fact, one of the softest Federations that I have seen from them, brand new. Generally the Feds soften up nicely with wear and weathering, in the crown area.

I personally feel that the LC HJ used a stiffer felt, as it just looks to be stiffer by how it creases out. And, I also think it(Akubra) makes for a great LC fedora, because I think it is fairly close to having the same characteristics of the LC film hat.


My own AB line can produce both looks, but lends itself to the Raiders fedora for two main reasons. One is the block shape that I use, and the other is my felt is not springy felt. You see two basic types of felt. One sort is springy, that is, if you push a dent in the side, it springs back out. The AB felt is the opposite. You push a small dent in the sides, and it stays. This non springy felt has always been my choice for the Raiders fedora.


In the end, if you are looking for a LC fedora, I highly recommend the Akubra Federation, or the Deluxe Federation. I also think I am one of a few that will steer folks to another brand of hat. I officially discontinued my rabbit line(although I break down occassionally and order a body for an Indy hat for folks who want a AB but cannot afford the beaver version, but want my block shape.


The LC felt, in my opinion, was more along the lines of most modern felt, while the Raiders version leaned toward the more traditonal vintage type of dress felt. Go for the Federation. When you get ready for a Raiders fedora, drop me or Marc a line. Both of our hats cater to the Raiders market. It is our passion, unlike other hatters who make hats for only the money. Fedora

Fedora-

I can't tell you how much I appreciate your honesty and integrity. I think that in itself speaks to your production values because you've proven that this truly your passion.

But fear not! 8)

I'm still in the process of deciding which bash would look good with my facial structure (which is very similar to that of Russ), so I don't know exactly which bash to go with yet. I've got a nice profile and frontal shot of myself, and I'm thinking of posting them on here to get some advice.


Cheers!


p.s. Fedora- I take it the beaver AB is a bit less "stiff" around the brim than the AFD?
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Post by Kaleponi Craig »

My AB is in the LC bash, and it has held up very well...KC
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Post by Fedora »

p.s. Fedora- I take it the beaver AB is a bit less "stiff" around the brim than the AFD?

Truthfully, I have gotten in a few runs that had more stiffener in the brim than I cared for. See, that is part of the hat business, sometimes consistency is not observed. But, that is a thing of the past now. My brims will be fairly soft now, and I will never have to live with the inconsistency in degreee of stiffener anymore. So, yes, my brims are much softer than the Federations, but, with that said, I have seen a couple of Federations that came from the factory with softer brims, but it is the exception rather than the rule. The good thing is, you can work that brim with your hands, and break much of that stiffener down to get you a more pliable brim.

My AB is in the LC bash, and it has held up very well...KC
Oh yes, do not get me wrong. The beaver felt and my blocks do quite well. I was just comparing my felt to the HJ felt used for the LC fedora. I have seen that felt, and reminds me of a thinner western felt. Fedora
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Post by Walden »

Fedora wrote:
p.s. Fedora- I take it the beaver AB is a bit less "stiff" around the brim than the AFD?

Truthfully, I have gotten in a few runs that had more stiffener in the brim than I cared for. See, that is part of the hat business, sometimes consistency is not observed. But, that is a thing of the past now. My brims will be fairly soft now, and I will never have to live with the inconsistency in degreee of stiffener anymore. So, yes, my brims are much softer than the Federations, but, with that said, I have seen a couple of Federations that came from the factory with softer brims, but it is the exception rather than the rule. The good thing is, you can work that brim with your hands, and break much of that stiffener down to get you a more pliable brim.

Yea, from what I've heard on here there seems to be a lot of variation in terms of production with the AFD. How would you break in the brim like that, just by flexing it?


Also, is that fedora in your avatar one of yours?
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Post by Fedora »

Yea, from what I've heard on here there seems to be a lot of variation in terms of production with the AFD. How would you break in the brim like that, just by flexing it?


Also, is that fedora in your avatar one of yours?

It depends on the amount of stiffener, as to how you would soften the brim up. If it is really cowboy stiff, or close to it, I would spray water on the brim, to add some flexing moisture and then work the brim with my hands. Do not use steam or heat, because once you separate the stiffner that is more or less welded together, apply heat, or steam sticks it all back together, with the result being a stiff brim once again. So, use a bit of moisture, and just your hands. Once you get it floppier, and the brim is still damp(damp and not soaked) style the brim the way you want it to stay, and let it dry at room temp, away from direct heat. That should do it.

That hat in my avatar is one of the three or 4 that I made for Pagey. It was such a nice pic, I had to steal it, and use it. :lol: Fedora
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Post by Walden »

Fedora wrote:
Yea, from what I've heard on here there seems to be a lot of variation in terms of production with the AFD. How would you break in the brim like that, just by flexing it?


Also, is that fedora in your avatar one of yours?

It depends on the amount of stiffener, as to how you would soften the brim up. If it is really cowboy stiff, or close to it, I would spray water on the brim, to add some flexing moisture and then work the brim with my hands. Do not use steam or heat, because once you separate the stiffner that is more or less welded together, apply heat, or steam sticks it all back together, with the result being a stiff brim once again. So, use a bit of moisture, and just your hands. Once you get it floppier, and the brim is still damp(damp and not soaked) style the brim the way you want it to stay, and let it dry at room temp, away from direct heat. That should do it.

That hat in my avatar is one of the three or 4 that I made for Pagey. It was such a nice pic, I had to steal it, and use it. :lol: Fedora

Fed-

Is the turnaround time on your AB beavers still around a month?
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Don't dis Stiffener eh!

Post by Kilgour Trout »

I know most folks like the soft pliable feel to their hats but I can't help lovin the crisp solid feel of a hat loaded with stiffener :shock: :lol: . I ordered my original AB that way and my "Some time soon" LC Grey that way as well.

For my purposes of dress, the stiffener keeps things uniform and sharp. For wreck hunting I'll take my Fed D into the Bush. When I get the chance I've got to find out what stiffener Steve uses, cuz its great stuff.
All it takes is a bit of steam and presto, my lid is reshaped for a month!! :lol:

Warmest Regards
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Post by IndyRich »

I have got an AB beaver with an LC bash. To quote Hemingway, it has held the bash like iron.

Image


Sorry for the poor quality of the pic
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So, which bash would look best on me?

Post by Walden »

Truth told, I'm a horribly indecisive person, so I'd like some opinions on which bash would look good for my face structure. Here are some pics.


The one in which i have a goatee is the most recent, and none are more than a few months old. Just some side shots and a frontal shot.

Number 1
Number 2
Number 3[/url]
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Post by Michaelson »

Your face and head shape remind me a lot of GraveRobbingGreg's head (that's a compliment, by the way :wink: ). Take a look at some of his photos (his avatar is a source). He has a Raider's type bash, though with a more relaxed front pinch, and I think it suits his face and shape perfectly.

It's something you can at least ponder as you approach this, but I think it's a good comparison.

Regards! Michaelson
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Post by Fedora »

Is the turnaround time on your AB beavers still around a month?

For the brown hats, the turnaround time is more like 5 to 6 weeks!! Business is good. But, for the gray hats, I have been waiting on gray bodies since December!! The shortage of beaver fur has been the culprit. The fur used for the light colored hats, of which gray uses the lighter beaver fur, has been in short supply due to China buying up so much with their new felt trade. I was told my the factory that the light colors were being run last week, so I hope to get in a load of the Raiders gray, any day now. I will be so happy when spring gets here, as I can get any body within a week of the time that I order. Hat season has a way of making us small hatters hurry up and wait. It drives me nuts!! Fedora
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Post by Minnesota Jones »

Even though I love my Raiders AB to pieces, as a nod to the PBBMs, I have three (two brown and one grey) and one of the browns is in my LC bash and it's held it shape just fine since I got it back in early 2003, and has softened up wonderfully (not that it was very stiff to begin with). Here's a couple pics of it from this past QM Summit in my LC Gear...

Image

Image

And an old shot of her on the rim of the Grand Canyon back in May of 2003...

Image
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Post by Hemingway Jones »

Minnesota Jones wrote: And an old shot of her on the rim of the Grand Canyon back in May of 2003...

Image
I'm assuming this picture was not taken on a windy day. :wink: :lol:
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Post by Bufflehead Jones »

Don't worry MJ, I climb down and get it for you. Heyyyyyyyyy...........
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Post by Walden »

Michaelson wrote:Your face and head shape remind me a lot of GraveRobbingGreg's head (that's a compliment, by the way :wink: ). Take a look at some of his photos (his avatar is a source). He has a Raider's type bash, though with a more relaxed front pinch, and I think it suits his face and shape perfectly.

It's something you can at least ponder as you approach this, but I think it's a good comparison.

Regards! Michaelson
I check his pics, and you're right. Thanks for the heads up! I often hear that I look like alot of people :), and is how I've made most of my friends: initially, they confuse me with someone else they know :D
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Post by Walden »

Fedora wrote:
Is the turnaround time on your AB beavers still around a month?

For the brown hats, the turnaround time is more like 5 to 6 weeks!! Business is good.
Eegads :shock:

Deciding which style fedora to get has been torturous enough, tacking on another 5-6 weeks will have me digging out my eyeballs with spoons.
I will be so happy when spring gets here, as I can get any body within a week of the time that I order. Hat season has a way of making us small hatters hurry up and wait. It drives me nuts!! Fedora
Oh, so you have to order the material before you can actually fill an order? Or is the time so long because you are solo op swamped with orders? :D Either way, glad to hear business is booming, even if would take forever to get my hat :wink:
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Post by Fedora »

Oh, so you have to order the material before you can actually fill an order? Or is the time so long because you are solo op swamped with orders? Either way, glad to hear business is booming, even if would take forever to get my hat

A bit of both. To let you guys in on the economics of hatmaking, here is a short lesson. Most hatters have to order their hat bodies in minimums. Mimimums can be as small as 60 bodies, in one color, with no mismatching of colors, like black, brown, pecan, grays, charcoal grey, etc. All liners and most sweats also have minimums, like 20 dozen. Now, in order to get any sort of return on that money that you have tied up, the majority of hatters charge 500 dollars and up on their beaver hats, just to warrant tieing up monies.

My price on my pure beaver hats is the lowest on the internet, and also the lowest priced pure beaver hat in walk in shops. So, how do I do that????

It involves sourcing suppliers that can sell you one hat body, or 100 dozen. I was lucky enough to find the felt supplier that does that, mainly because they cater to small hatters who cannot afford to tie up the big bucks. And as far as I know, this company is the only one out there that will sell you just a few bodies.

I can make and sell a pure beaver hat(for 225.00) only because I do not have to tie up thousands and thousands of dollars in bodies and parts. The only thing that I have to buy in minimums are the liners, and the ribbon.

When I started this little enterprise, I wanted to make the best looking Indy fedora, that I could not find from anywhere else. And, I tried. I have spent a couple of grand over the last 10 years, buying all of those Indy fedoras that are offered by others. And none of them, not one, was using the best felt. Most were disposable hats, IMHO. Hats were once made not as a throwaway item, but something that could be reblocked and rebuilt for years to come due to the good felt that was used to make the hat. And, I was sick and tired of paying hundreds of dollars for a hat. I regularly paid 400 bucks and even over 5 hundred for a hat. But, that was the price you had to shell out to own one.


So, I worked it out to where I could offer a great Indy fedora, using better felt than 99 per cent of the other Indy fedoras, and at a price that most could afford. Part of this involved not having to tie up money. The feltmaker allowed for this to happen.

The way that I do business, once I receive the order, I order bodies. The downside to this, is if the felter runs out of fur, due to the extra demand brought on by China, I may have to wait for more than my usual 3 days to receive the bodies. This happens during hat season, or the winter months. I am hoping once everything settles down with the new demand for fur, this wait will get like it used to be, that is, 3 days.

I know that the turnaround time can get a bit longer, at times, but another good hatter tells me, his turnaround time is 8 months now for a custom hat. If a guy can get you a custom hat, in a couple of weeks, he ain't selling many hats. :wink:

I do not keep hats sitting on a shelf. The hats leave me as soon as I finish them up. I wish I had time to make up some in various sizes, so I could just cut the brims to what the customer wanted, and then send them out. I have never had enough down time to do that. Handmaking a hat, using no machinery is very labor intensive. Of course, it would be easier for me to get a hat company to factory make my hats, but that would be against what I stand for. I want my customers to own a hat just like the ones that came from those small custom hatshops that dotted the landscape back in the early part of the 20th century. I have no lady that does the installations like some hatters do. No one touches my hats, but me. It would be so much easier and faster to just subcontract the ribbon, sweat and liners out to someone else, but then, I would not be making the hat, just the blockwork. I have have offers from other hatters to just supply me with the hat, and then I would just sell it as my own. No way Hose!!
I will always offer the handmade hats, as that is my hobby, and my love.


If the turnaround time bothers you, there are so many other options out there. But, you will not get the same quality, for the same price. That I can guarantee. No one else will make and sell this cheap, and I only do it because it is my passion, the Indy fedora.


Now, if anyone ever gets tired of waiting, I will be glad to refund your money to you, with no hard feelings at all. I understand how hard it is to wait on a hat. I used to be a hat customer just like you guys. And, I am one of a few that will gladly refund your money, for any reason at all.

I had a guy who ordered a hat late last year, and wanted it by a certain date. At the time, I saw no problem with getting it to him by that date. Then, the beaver fur shortage hit. I got behind, on all orders, through no fault of my own. IF you ain't got the bodies, you can't make a hat!! Since I literally had a ton of reblocks, mostly vintage hats, to do, I still worked on hats every single day, just not new hats. But, I just refunded his money to him, with no questions asked. And the only refund I have ever made to anyone. Because of the demeanor of this guy, it will be a cold day in Hades before I would ever spend my time on a hat for him. He will not ever wear one of my hats-period. Look, I still see myself as giving these things away, practically, and if you are ugly to me, well..............you deserve no favors from me. I almost have to like you in order to make you one, and there are even a few folks, not here mind you, that will never own something that I have sweated over and worried over to make. This is not to discourage my customers from ever asking for a refund, far from it. I firmly believe in a money back guarantee, as even 225.00 is alot of money for a hat for most folks. So, if you do not think the hat is worth the price,(or you just do not like it) I insist on refunding the funds back to you as long as you have not ruined the hat. At my prices, eating a ruined hat is expensive due to the low profit margins. If the hat is unworned, I can just strip it down, sanitize it, and use it for the next hat. No losses.


I know this is a long post, but I just want the new folks to know that I originally started making hats as a favor, and to allow my comrades to own the finest felt made-beaver, and at a steal of a price. I am not in this for the money. If I were, my hats would be priced comparable with all of the others(who mostly make factory hats using the high volume equipment once only found in big factories like Stetson, but sell them at premium prices) Nothing wrong with that, as they are making a living from the hat business. But, I am not the typical hatter, when it comes to my handmade Indy fedoras. I have been called an idiot by some hatters, and patted on the back by others. I have always said, that when I get tired of this hat deal, I will just close shop and go fishing, or spend more time on my other hobbies. But, fear not, because I figured at some point in time, I would stop the handmade business, and that is the main reason that I offered Marc Kitter the chance to make my brand of hats, using the same tradtional, handmade techniques, that were part and parcel of the small hatshops back in the day. He is a young guy, young enough to be my son,and he also shares this passion with the Indy fedora. He is obsessed, the same way that I am. A perfect partner, to carry on the AB handmade tradition that I started. And he loves it!! That was the prerequisite, and it also helped that he had the skills, and aptitude to do this. So, when I am gone, hopefully the AB hat will still be around, although you will never be able to buy this type of hat in the beaver felt at what I charge. The AB name is very important to me. It signifies who I am, and the type of guy that I am, and through hard work, and treating folks the way I want to be treated, it has been a success, although at times too successful. :lol: But, I keep cranking these hats out, one per day.

If the next Indy film ever comes out, I know that there is no way I will ever be able to keep up. At that time, if I am still making hats, my hats will only be sold my word of mouth-the handmade ones that is. :wink: It has to be this way, as I refuse to have help on my handmade Indy fedoras. But, I am working on a deal with another friend and fan to have a factory produce my brand of hats, as a factory hat, using my blocks, my liners, my sweats and the HJ ribbon. Not pure beaver felt, but a higher quality felt than you see in most factory hats today. It will not be a disposable hat, but a good quality hat, and as accurate as mine are now in looks. All I have to do is to come up with the money necessary to have several sets of blocks made, in reg ovals and long ovals, and the funds to buy up the parts needed, like sweats, HJ ribbon, and my liners. It will be the best looking and accurate factory hat available, or I will not sell them. My name is very important to me. It will be for the masses of new Indy fans that will join the ranks when the film hits the theaters. But, it will be a great hat. The hat factories could not keep up with the demand for those Indy hats that were sold that did not even have the right creases, or dimensions. This time around, due to the internet, new fans will become more savy with one click of the mouse. :wink: I want to be involved in supplying at least an accurate Indy fedora, as I see that as my mission in the few years that I have left, since I ain't no spring chicken. The handmade hats will then be a perk for COW members. And, only COW members. I do not know how else I could do it really. There is just one of me!! Sorry for the long post, but I just want the new folks to know I ain't your typical hatter. Thanks!! Steve
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Post by Indakin »

### steve, great post...uhhh i might ahve to buy one of your ABs later this year or beginning of next before you stop hand making them. :)
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Post by Fedora »

:shock: I just reread my post, and it sounds almost arrogant to me. Now, you guys here that know me, from phone conversations and such, know that I am not that way at all. So, you new guys, do not take this post in the wrong way. I started to delete it, but it really says much about my whole attitude with the hat making business, while giving you an insight in how I can undercut other hatters the way that I do, and the reason for doing so. I always throw in the retiring bit about the handmade hats, because I honestly do not know how much longer that I will do it. If I get up one morning and say to myself, ok, I have had enough, time to move on, I will just make the announcement and finish up the existing orders, and then just do nothing but renovate the 589(or whatever that number will be) hats that I have made to date. I could not very well sell one of my hats and then have someone else do the reblocks and parts replacement!!(I do not trust some folks, on refurbs, through my own experience) But, going by my history so far on reblocks of my hats, that will not take up much time. So, if you own one of my hats, fear not, I will take care of you guys, as you trusted me, from the get-go, and I do not turn my back on folks that spent their hard earned money with me. These hats will outlast me, but Marc will be around, I can almost guarantee that!! I know that under normal wear and tear, my hats will be here over 20 years from now, although everyone may be wearing a Cairo AB by that time. The felt will still have integrity, but the hat will look like it has been through a few adventures. The dye used to make these hats is exceptional stuff. It will not fade out to any other color but brown. It will just lighten up from the sun exposure. Fedora



.
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Post by The Omega Man »

Hey Walden!
I too like the LC style the best. I have an Akubra Federation myself.
It looks fantastic and holds its shape perfectly. I have had this particular hat for about three years or so and it has seen plenty of rain, snow, sand, sweat, dust, squishings, and trips to Joshua Tree. It has passed all with flying colors!
Just my opinion. :)
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Post by Walden »

Fedora wrote:
Oh, so you have to order the material before you can actually fill an order? Or is the time so long because you are solo op swamped with orders? Either way, glad to hear business is booming, even if would take forever to get my hat


My price on my pure beaver hats is the lowest on the internet, and also the lowest priced pure beaver hat in walk in shops. So, how do I do that????
I remember you telling me this in our initial emails after I first found out about your site. I was the doof asking about layaways :). At that time I did chalk it up to a vendor being arrogant about his wares. However, researching other beaver hats and knowing you from COW has convinced me that my initial assumption was as far from the truth as I could get
When I started this little enterprise, I wanted to make the best looking Indy fedora, that I could not find from anywhere else. And, I tried. I have spent a couple of grand over the last 10 years, buying all of those Indy fedoras that are offered by others. And none of them, not one, was using the best felt. Most were disposable hats, IMHO. Hats were once made not as a throwaway item, but something that could be reblocked and rebuilt for years to come due to the good felt that was used to make the hat. And, I was sick and tired of paying hundreds of dollars for a hat. I regularly paid 400 bucks and even over 5 hundred for a hat. But, that was the price you had to shell out to own one.
This is why I quickly discounted all other hats than yours and the akubras. I've had akubras for a long time, I know how they handle and i know they are quality hads. Your product, while essentially an unknown to me (at this point), has a demonstrably rabid fanbase on this forum :wink: , and cheap or illmade products don't get that.


If the turnaround time bothers you, there are so many other options out there. But, you will not get the same quality, for the same price. That I can guarantee. No one else will make and sell this cheap, and I only do it because it is my passion, the Indy fedora.
Technically, it's not really the turnaround time that bothers me.

I'm a horribly impatient and impulsive person, so my difficulties with the wait time (which, for a hand made hat, really isn't that long) stems from a personal failing of myself and is no fault of yours, I apologize if I made it seem any other way.



I know this is a long post, but I just want the new folks to know that I originally started making hats as a favor, and to allow my comrades to own the finest felt made-beaver, and at a steal of a price. I am not in this for the money. If I were, my hats would be priced comparable with all of the others(who mostly make factory hats using the high volume equipment once only found in big factories like Stetson, but sell them at premium prices) Nothing wrong with that, as they are making a living from the hat business. But, I am not the typical hatter, when it comes to my handmade Indy fedoras. I have been called an idiot by some hatters, and patted on the back by others. I have always said, that when I get tired of this hat deal, I will just close shop and go fishing, or spend more time on my other hobbies. But, fear not, because I figured at some point in time, I would stop the handmade business, and that is the main reason that I offered Marc Kitter the chance to make my brand of hats, using the same tradtional, handmade techniques, that were part and parcel of the small hatshops back in the day. He is a young guy, young enough to be my son,and he also shares this passion with the Indy fedora. He is obsessed, the same way that I am. A perfect partner, to carry on the AB handmade tradition that I started. And he loves it!! That was the prerequisite, and it also helped that he had the skills, and aptitude to do this. So, when I am gone, hopefully the AB hat will still be around, although you will never be able to buy this type of hat in the beaver felt at what I charge. The AB name is very important to me. It signifies who I am, and the type of guy that I am, and through hard work, and treating folks the way I want to be treated, it has been a success, although at times too successful. :lol: But, I keep cranking these hats out, one per day.

If the next Indy film ever comes out, I know that there is no way I will ever be able to keep up. At that time, if I am still making hats, my hats will only be sold my word of mouth-the handmade ones that is. :wink: It has to be this way, as I refuse to have help on my handmade Indy fedoras. But, I am working on a deal with another friend and fan to have a factory produce my brand of hats, as a factory hat, using my blocks, my liners, my sweats and the HJ ribbon. Not pure beaver felt, but a higher quality felt than you see in most factory hats today. It will not be a disposable hat, but a good quality hat, and as accurate as mine are now in looks. All I have to do is to come up with the money necessary to have several sets of blocks made, in reg ovals and long ovals, and the funds to buy up the parts needed, like sweats, HJ ribbon, and my liners. It will be the best looking and accurate factory hat available, or I will not sell them. My name is very important to me. It will be for the masses of new Indy fans that will join the ranks when the film hits the theaters. But, it will be a great hat. The hat factories could not keep up with the demand for those Indy hats that were sold that did not even have the right creases, or dimensions. This time around, due to the internet, new fans will become more savy with one click of the mouse. :wink: I want to be involved in supplying at least an accurate Indy fedora, as I see that as my mission in the few years that I have left, since I ain't no spring chicken. The handmade hats will then be a perk for COW members. And, only COW members. I do not know how else I could do it really. There is just one of me!! Sorry for the long post, but I just want the new folks to know I ain't your typical hatter. Thanks!! Steve

This is precisely why I'm getting my AB in the next few months. When does spring start, anyway, cuz that's probably when I'm going to order mine.
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Post by Bufflehead Jones »

If anyone has ever talked to Steve on the phone, I am sure that you would agree that he is one of the most friendly, down to earth guys that you would ever hope to meet. I don't think that the post sounded arrogant or bad in any way. You are an honest vender and are giving an honest critique of your services, expressing it to the best of your ability.

If I call to talk to Steve about my hat, we usually talk half of the day. Hey, Steve, maybe that's why you only do one hat a day! Just kidding, buddy. It is a good thing that I have free long distance, though.

Steve made it possible for a lot of us to own a hat of such high quality, that most of us probably didn't think that it would be possible. Most of us would never have even known of hats of this quality, or where to start to try to find one.

Not to mention, that they are the most screen accurate Indy Fedora available anywhere on the planet. Even the original supplier of the hats for the movies, Herbert Johnson, can no longer make a hat that is anywhere near as screen accurate as what Steve produces.

We can go on and on, talking about the lost art of hatmaking that Steve is keeping alive. Old methods and techniques, and tools that are antiques and no longer made. These are truly a custom, handmade hat that is made the old fashioned way. Like they say, "they don't make 'em like that anymore". Well, Steve does.

It has been said that all good things must come to an end. I know this includes Steve's hats. I only ask of Steve that when this time comes, he gives me enough advance notice that I can get my final order in. Thanks, Steve! :clap:
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Post by Michaelson »

Funny, anytime I call Steve, we end up talking about gardening. Does he make hats too? :shock: :lol: :wink:

Regards! Michaelson
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Post by Hemingway Jones »

I have a renewed appreciation for mine as well.
Steve, you know I truly appreciate everything you do; from the hats to the knowledge you put forth.
I don't know if I can thank you enough, my friend! :wink: :D
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Post by Walden »

Fedora wrote:
So, does the AFD or the AB hold the LC bash better? Price isn't a concern here, but I will be getting one hat at a time lest my wife kick me in the head , so I want to be sure to get the right one for my style at first.

That said, I've heard overwhelmingly positive things about both the AFD and AB, but I've still got some issues to work out. My Concerns:

1. I've owned various akubra's for a long time, so I know how to care for them, etc. I also know they can be stiff as ####, so I'm guessing from experience the AFD will be the same. Will it gradually soften as my other akubra hats have? From the pics on here I've seen, it doesn't present a particularly good ROTLA bash, so will it hold a good LC Bash?
2. Is the AB made specifically with the Raiders bash in mind?
I have owned literally a score of the Akubra Federation. In fact, I just made one of my hats for one brother, while this guy's brother ordered a Deluxe Fed and had it sent to me to do the creases. It was a 7 3/8 size hat. Now, this particular Federation that I just creased, had the standard stiff brim, but the crown of the hat was decently soft. In fact, one of the softest Federations that I have seen from them, brand new. Generally the Feds soften up nicely with wear and weathering, in the crown area.

I personally feel that the LC HJ used a stiffer felt, as it just looks to be stiffer by how it creases out. And, I also think it(Akubra) makes for a great LC fedora, because I think it is fairly close to having the same characteristics of the LC film hat.


My own AB line can produce both looks, but lends itself to the Raiders fedora for two main reasons. One is the block shape that I use, and the other is my felt is not springy felt. You see two basic types of felt. One sort is springy, that is, if you push a dent in the side, it springs back out. The AB felt is the opposite. You push a small dent in the sides, and it stays. This non springy felt has always been my choice for the Raiders fedora.


In the end, if you are looking for a LC fedora, I highly recommend the Akubra Federation, or the Deluxe Federation. I also think I am one of a few that will steer folks to another brand of hat. I officially discontinued my rabbit line(although I break down occassionally and order a body for an Indy hat for folks who want a AB but cannot afford the beaver version, but want my block shape.


The LC felt, in my opinion, was more along the lines of most modern felt, while the Raiders version leaned toward the more traditonal vintage type of dress felt. Go for the Federation. When you get ready for a Raiders fedora, drop me or Marc a line. Both of our hats cater to the Raiders market. It is our passion, unlike other hatters who make hats for only the money. Fedora

Fed-

You were right. Over the weekend I watched ROTLA and LC, along with all the bonus feature stuff, and it looks like the LC was significantly stiffer than the the Rotla. You can tell in several instances when the Rotla fedora's brim folds as the wind picks up. In the LC bonus material you see the wind going so much it blows the fedora off his head, but you never see the brim bend any.
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Post by Minnesota Jones »

Hemingway Jones wrote:
Minnesota Jones wrote: And an old shot of her on the rim of the Grand Canyon back in May of 2003...

Image
I'm assuming this picture was not taken on a windy day. :wink: :lol:
Sorry, just saw this again. Actually, there was a little wind and I WAS worried, so the whole set the fedora down, snap the pic, immediately grab the fedora, was about 5 seconds or so... :lol: My wife was laughing the whole time. 8)
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