Todds Costumes ?'s

Fedoraman · Post by **Fedoraman** » Thu Aug 25, 2005 8:43 am

I was looking over the site http://www.toddscostumes.com in the Indy section and I can't believe the pricing on the HJ fedora's. Are these really the same hats sold by HJ in the shop in England or just a licensed name?

The prices are nearly half of what you would pay if you ordered directly from HJ...

What is the quality like compared to what you would get from HJ?

VP · Post by VP » Thu Aug 25, 2005 9:02 am

The ones in there are the same ones that are sold by Indyfedora.com.

Fedora · Post by **Fedora** » Thu Aug 25, 2005 10:36 am

This is a curious thing. The block shape used on the German HJs seem to be different(better) than what is sold my HJ and Todd. At least the pics I have seen seem to bear this out. I was in contact with Hj earlier in the year when I was thinking about offering a new reblocked HJ. From converstions that I and others have had with them at the wholesale level, it seems that they may be getting their hats made for them, by someone else. But, I am not 100 per cent positive on this. This may explain the difference in block shapes we are seeing, currently. What makes me think they are buyng them already made comes from the fact that we were told we could not source their ribbon, as they get in one for each hat they have.

No extras. Of course, if they were doing their own hats, in their own factory, they would have ribbon by the roll. Fedora

Fedoraman · Post by **Fedoraman** » Thu Aug 25, 2005 1:26 pm

Fedora wrote:This is a curious thing. The block shape used on the German HJs seem to be different(better) than what is sold my HJ and Todd. At least the pics I have seen seem to bear this out. I was in contact with Hj earlier in the year when I was thinking about offering a new reblocked HJ. From converstions that I and others have had with them at the wholesale level, it seems that they may be getting their hats made for them, by someone else. But, I am not 100 per cent positive on this.

This seemed peculiar to me as well - I was following your posts about trying to offer HJ's from you blocking a while back, but it seemed you hit a brick wall. Then a few days ago I remembered Todd's Costumes - your assesment seems valid as they are selling the hats in Europe (www.indyfedora.com) branded by HJ at a significantly lower price than HJ offers if you buy directly from them. This is very peculiar to me, as one would assume that buying from the supposed "original" supplier would naturally be cheaper - unless the reseller has negociated a deal with HJ to sell hats finished and blocked by a third party...

Still the question at hand is: WHAT IS THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THESE "HJ" FEDORA'S AND THE ONES OFFERED BY TODD'S COSTUMES AND INDYFEDORA.COM?!?

Recently, there has been a string of emails posted in another thread about HJ trying to reclaim the "Indy" market by finding the original blocks, correct dimensions, etc. but as we all know, the felt bodies (the true core of every hat) are made from inferior rabbit fur felt - which makes them prone to shrinkage, color fading, etc. - so, if HJ is trying to appeal to the masses, why don't they offer comparable pricing to the resellers? Is there truly a difference in these hats? Are they all finished and blocked at HJ then shipped out or what?

Fedora wrote:This may explain the difference in block shapes we are seeing, currently. What makes me think they are buyng them already made comes from the fact that we were told we could not source their ribbon, as they get in one for each hat they have. No extras. Of course, if they were doing their own hats, in their own factory, they would have ribbon by the roll. What you HJ fans need to do is to get together, 12 of you, and order wholesale. You could save lots of money!! Fedora

Todd's Costumes has a link in the Fedora section for replacement ribbons:

http://www.toddscostumes.com/indy/repla ... ribbon.htm

Oh, please clarify your statement of the "12" order - is there a link that if you order 12 or more HJ's you get a discount???

Fedora · Post by **Fedora** » Thu Aug 25, 2005 2:23 pm

I had read recently where someone went to the HJ shop and the brims were stiff. The current HJs from Todd and Germany have really soft felt, and the brims are not stiff. Are they all the same felt? Does not sound like it to me. Perhaps the HJ shop still has old stock? Could be. Regarding the current HJs, I must say that when new, the felt sure soft and very easy to style. I have one from Todd, and after I reblocked it, it has held the shape quite well, although I have kept it dry.

On the rabbit felt, remember there are various grades of this felt. Really good rabbit felt, like on the vintage Borsalinos was a thing of beauty and very, very good. Just ask any vintage Borsalino owner. The trouble is, most rabbit felt nowadays does not approach that high quality stuff of yesteryear. A shame too because rabbit felt is lighter and more comfortable in the hot months. Beaver is so dense that it does not allow much air to penetrate. But beaver, lasts a whole lot longer and you get what you pay for in felt.

On the 12 remark, let me retract that. I do not want to hurt Todd, and this would do it. You could save a little money, but not much. Todd is not marking his hats up very much at all, and is way below the usual mark up in hats. Give him your business, and keep him able to supply these hats. I bought one of them, and will buy another soon. That one will stay, brand new in the box, unopened because if Indy 4 uses HJ, this will be what is used. I want one put back for 30 years from now. Then, when the arguments come up, I will have the exact hat!! Something you guys ought to think about too. It would be an investment of sorts. Fedora

Fedora · Post by **Fedora** » Thu Aug 25, 2005 3:48 pm

Ok, old Fedora will now own a new non AB hat!! I am about to order one from Todd. So now, I own two of the current HJs. This one will be packed back in moth balls. Plus, it was time for a new hat!! regards, Fedora

Post by **Michaelson** » Thu Aug 25, 2005 4:19 pm

Fedora wrote: I want one put back for 30 years from now. Then, when the arguments come up, I will have the exact hat!! Fedora

Oh goody. Something to look forward to in my twilight years.....

Regards! Michaelson

binkmeisterRick · Post by **binkmeisterRick** » Thu Aug 25, 2005 4:32 pm

Michaelson, I thought that started centuries ago!

bink

Post by **Michaelson** » Thu Aug 25, 2005 4:35 pm

Well, maybe, but that was before I got bifocals! Man, that will be around TRIfocal time. Not sure I'll be able to keep up....

Regards! Michaelson

binkmeisterRick · Post by **binkmeisterRick** » Thu Aug 25, 2005 4:39 pm

It's only a matter of time before you need quadfocals!

bink

Post by **Michaelson** » Thu Aug 25, 2005 4:41 pm

Who knows, by then we may have replacement eyeballs!

Regards! Michaelson

binkmeisterRick · Post by **binkmeisterRick** » Thu Aug 25, 2005 4:44 pm

Like Sammy Davis Jr.?

bink

Hemingway Jones · Post by **Hemingway Jones** » Thu Aug 25, 2005 4:47 pm

Sandy Duncan?

binkmeisterRick · Post by **binkmeisterRick** » Thu Aug 25, 2005 4:52 pm

Dunkin Donuts? Oh, waitaminute...

bink

Hemingway Jones · Post by **Hemingway Jones** » Thu Aug 25, 2005 4:53 pm

Tom Cruise in "Minority Report?"

prairiejones · Post by **prairiejones** » Thu Aug 25, 2005 5:40 pm

I've always loved the Cairo style on Todd's site. It has the brim that I model mine after.

Erri · Post by **Erri** » Thu Aug 25, 2005 6:34 pm

prairiejones wrote:I've always loved the Cairo style on Todd's site. It has the brim that I model mine after.

Yeah it looks great! I wonder if anyone on this forum has a Todd's HJ

Fedoraman · Post by **Fedoraman** » Thu Aug 25, 2005 6:35 pm

Fedora wrote:Ok, old Fedora will now own a new non AB hat!! I am about to order one from Todd. So now, I own two of the current HJs. This one will be packed back in moth balls. Plus, it was time for a new hat!! regards, Fedora

+1 But I doubt that mine will be in moth balls...

Bufflehead Jones · Post by **Bufflehead Jones** » Thu Aug 25, 2005 7:13 pm

erri_wan wrote:
prairiejones wrote:I've always loved the Cairo style on Todd's site. It has the brim that I model mine after.
Yeah it looks great! I wonder if anyone on this forum has a Todd's HJ

Yes. I do.

prairiejones · Post by **prairiejones** » Thu Aug 25, 2005 8:09 pm

I'll also be doing the Cairo to my AB. Hopefully, next week.

I wouldn't mind having an HJ. But at this point, I would drop the dinero on beaver. The beaver hats have been superior through out the past. I take that from my mother and father. Both children of WWII.
Love the Todd bashes, though. Some of the best I have seen.

BendingOak · Post by **BendingOak** » Thu Aug 25, 2005 8:12 pm

I have a todd's Herbert Johnson and wished i saved my money and not got it. it's not worth the price tag.

Erri · Post by **Erri** » Fri Aug 26, 2005 4:17 am

jpenman wrote:I have a todd's Herbert Johnson and wished i saved my money and not got it. it's not worth the price tag.

Ah, this is convincing

Thanks jpenman, because i was already thinking about buying it

:lol:

binkmeisterRick · Post by **binkmeisterRick** » Fri Aug 26, 2005 7:14 am

Just for the sake of argument, Fedora mentioned above that he is likely to get another HJ from Todd. I'd ask folks why they do or don't like this hat before coming to your own decision on whether or not to get one yourself.

bink

Erri · Post by **Erri** » Fri Aug 26, 2005 7:35 am

binkmeisterRick wrote:Just for the sake of argument, Fedora mentioned above that he is likely to get another HJ from Todd. I'd ask folks why they do or don't like this hat before coming to your own decision on whether or not to get one yourself.

bink

I thought that Fedora wanted one just to have an original HJ of indy4 time for the future

binkmeisterRick · Post by **binkmeisterRick** » Fri Aug 26, 2005 7:59 am

Yes, but he also said this about Todd's current HJ offerings:

The current HJs from Todd and Germany have really soft felt, and the brims are not stiff. Are they all the same felt? Does not sound like it to me. Perhaps the HJ shop still has old stock? Could be. Regarding the current HJs, I must say that when new, the felt sure soft and very easy to style. I have one from Todd, and after I reblocked it, it has held the shape quite well, although I have kept it dry.

He was getting the second one to store away in the box. I'm not saying you should or shouldn't buy one of Todd's HJ's. Rather, there are various views on this (and every) hat and that one should base his or her purchase decisions on all sides of the argument, not just the "I hate it" posts. Why does someone like a certain hat? Why do they hate it?

Jpenman, please don't take this as me picking on you, because I'm not, really. You have your reasons on why you dislike the hat and I have no issue with that. I guess if someone's going to not buy a hat because of posts stating folks don't like a certain hat, I'm always interested in knowing why, just as Fedora stated above why he is going to get one, instead of just saying "I like it." Does that make sense?

bink

Erri · Post by **Erri** » Fri Aug 26, 2005 8:10 am

I perfectly see the point binkmeisterRick

Well yes i would be curious to know why hate or why love it.
I love arguments and counter arguments

:post: Anyway i dont have money to afford a HJ right now

binkmeisterRick · Post by **binkmeisterRick** » Fri Aug 26, 2005 8:13 am

No money? Then why do you want to buy a hat, anyway?!

I don't currently have the money, either, but if Herbert Johnson starts putting out a hat again like they did long ago, then I wouldn't mind adding one to my collection someday. Still, I love hats so much that I like to see all sides of the coin when talking about any particular hat.

bink

Erri · Post by **Erri** » Fri Aug 26, 2005 8:14 am

binkmeisterRick wrote:No money? Then why do you want to buy a hat, anyway?!

if i dont have money it doesnt mean i'm not planning to buy one

but i bet you already know this

we are all alike i think

binkmeisterRick · Post by **binkmeisterRick** » Fri Aug 26, 2005 8:16 am

I plan to buy a billion hats before I die, even though I don't have the cash for it now. You're right, though. It's always goo dto have aplan so you know what you're saving for!

bink

Dakota Ellison · Post by **Dakota Ellison** » Fri Aug 26, 2005 9:44 am

The hat I ordered from Todd was out of stock for my size, so I asked him to special order an uncut, unshaped Poet from HJ. That's what I got, and I'm happy with the way it turned out. If HJ starts producing a better hat than the one I got, it will really be something.

Erri · Post by **Erri** » Fri Aug 26, 2005 9:54 am

Dakota Ellison wrote:The hat I ordered from Todd was out of stock for my size, so I asked him to special order an uncut, unshaped Poet from HJ. That's what I got, and I'm happy with the way it turned out. If HJ starts producing a better hat than the one I got, it will really be something.

Any pic to share?

:D

VP · Post by VP » Fri Aug 26, 2005 10:10 am

Erri · Post by **Erri** » Fri Aug 26, 2005 10:15 am

VP wrote:http://images10.fotki.com/v203/photos/4 ... 001-vi.jpg
http://images7.fotki.com/v157/photos/4/ ... 011-vi.jpg
http://images6.fotki.com/v162/photos/4/ ... est-vi.jpg

is it your hat VP or dakota ellison one?

VP · Post by VP » Fri Aug 26, 2005 10:18 am

DE's.

Erri · Post by **Erri** » Fri Aug 26, 2005 10:19 am

Looks nice

I would love to have so tall humps

BendingOak · Post by **BendingOak** » Fri Aug 26, 2005 10:23 am

Alright bink here you go , and I don't think you are picking on me. First i think Todd is a nice guy and was easy to talk with to get my hat ( that not the problem ). I think the block is wrong and the quality of the hat is just not worth the price tag( the hat tappered fast and looked a little olive. I had steve reblock it to get the tapper out of it and its doing ok but I think if I just pass a glass of water it's going to tapper again. I lost a little crown hieght because Steve block is fuller ( correct for raiders ). So I change the bash to a LC and looks fine.
I would rather spent the money on one of Steve's hat and have Quality , the look and not have to worry about anything.

Steve I would order one from indyfedora.com only based on the fact I think there block is looks more right ( straight sides).

Guys and dolls look at the two HJ that people have here that we like Pagey and elodie ( I think they both got them at indyfedora.com). Correct me if I'm wrong here ( Pagey and Elodie ). One last thing just look at the open crown shot on both sites. I cant say anything about quality but atleast you can get the right block shape. Don't even think about getting it wet.

Is that working for you Mr. Bink.

Post by **Michaelson** » Fri Aug 26, 2005 10:31 am

jpenman wrote: but I think if I just pass a glass of water it's going to taper again.

OUCH!!

Man, that sounds like the old Miller felt! Wow!

Regards! Michaelson

Hemingway Jones · Post by **Hemingway Jones** » Fri Aug 26, 2005 10:34 am

Michaelson wrote:
jpenman wrote: but I think if I just pass a glass of water it's going to taper again.
OUCH!! Man, that sounds like the old Miller felt! Wow!

Regards! Michaelson

It's time to break out the taper pic again:

Sometimes, I just need to do that. Sorry. 8-[

Post by **Michaelson** » Fri Aug 26, 2005 10:45 am

Slow day at the bank, eh?

Regards! Michaelson

Hemingway Jones · Post by **Hemingway Jones** » Fri Aug 26, 2005 12:05 pm

Michaelson wrote:Slow day at the bank, eh?

Regards! Michaelson

Ain't it the truth!

You know me too well.

Post by **Michaelson** » Fri Aug 26, 2005 12:53 pm

Regards! Michaelson

binkmeisterRick · Post by **binkmeisterRick** » Fri Aug 26, 2005 1:25 pm

jpenman wrote: Is that working for you Mr. Bink.

Yep! It makes perfect sense to me. I just like stories, that's all.

bink

Post by **Michaelson** » Fri Aug 26, 2005 3:29 pm

WELL, then..

"It was a dark and stormy night,....."

Regards! Michaelson

binkmeisterRick · Post by **binkmeisterRick** » Fri Aug 26, 2005 4:42 pm

I knew I could count on you!

bink

BendingOak · Post by **BendingOak** » Fri Aug 26, 2005 6:05 pm

I aim to please ( or is that please to aim).

Todds Costumes ?'s

Todds Costumes ?'s

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