New Vintage version of U.S. Wings Kevlar jacket available

Post by **Michaelson** » Mon Aug 16, 2004 9:57 am

Take a look at the new version of Kevlar jacket Wings is now offering:

http://www.uswings.com/aviatn.asp#VKevIJ

Regards. Michaelson

IndyBlues · Post by **IndyBlues** » Mon Aug 16, 2004 10:31 am

Looks pretty cool. Altho, the distressed one may give a criminal more reason to shoot AT the jacket, as opposed to ruining a nice new hide, like the un-distressed model. He may think, I better aim for a headshot, because I would't want to ruin that nice looking jacket.

My advice, go for the distressed, take a bullet to the chest.

Sorry, it's still early, neeeeed cofffeeeeeee!

Post by **Michaelson** » Mon Aug 16, 2004 10:44 am

I'll fax you a cup.

Regards. Michaelson

Indiana Joe · Post by **Indiana Joe** » Mon Aug 16, 2004 2:06 pm

Slightly on topic---why will the Kevlar not stop a knife stab but will stop a bullet?

McFly · Post by **McFly** » Mon Aug 16, 2004 2:13 pm

Because a bullet is smaller and going so much faster... or...

I don't know... but it's a good jacket to use if you want that Raiders screen accurate bullet hole in your shoulder. Also might be good for being dragged behind a truck.

In Christ,
Shane

FLATHEAD · Post by **FLATHEAD** » Mon Aug 16, 2004 2:27 pm

It might have something to do with the fact that a bullet will
deform on contact, and a steel knife blade will not.

The bullet will deform, and become larger at its point of contact than
when it was fired from the gun.

The knife will remain with a sharp point, which can penatrate the fibers
of the weave, which a bullet can't.

Flathead

McFly · Post by **McFly** » Mon Aug 16, 2004 2:58 pm

Oh, you're right! I thought of a knife being bigger than a bullet in the sense of length and width... but that point is pretty small, and could probably get through, you're right.

Extra credit for you!

In Christ,
Shane

Post by **Michaelson** » Mon Aug 16, 2004 3:09 pm

On target. Oldest story I remember when videotaping TRT response training for DOE was when Kevlar vests were first introduced. A vendor was demonstrating a vest to a group, and apparently never read his own training literature, as he invited somebody from the audience to stab him with a supplied tando knife. Needless to say, it penetrated, and the poor fellow bled to death before they got him out of the room. Apparently he was supposed to demonstrate the Kevlar's ability to resist the slashing motion of a knife, rather than a stabbing action. Sad, but true. Regards. Michaelson

Pyroxene · Post by **Pyroxene** » Mon Aug 16, 2004 3:24 pm

So, when it says, "Not intended to protect against...sharp edged or pointed instruments."

I guess you are not talking piccolo or trumpets?

just kidding

Indiana Jess · Post by **Indiana Jess** » Mon Aug 16, 2004 3:35 pm

Pyroxene wrote:So, when it says, "Not intended to protect against...sharp edged or pointed instruments."

I guess you are not talking piccolo or trumpets?

just kidding

Depending on who's playing them, one might want to invest in some kevlar earplugs

Indiana Joe · Post by **Indiana Joe** » Mon Aug 16, 2004 8:57 pm

FLATHEAD wrote:It might have something to do with the fact that a bullet will
deform on contact, and a steel knife blade will not.

The bullet will deform, and become larger at its point of contact than
when it was fired from the gun.

The knife will remain with a sharp point, which can penatrate the fibers
of the weave, which a bullet can't.

Flathead

Michaelson wrote:On target. Oldest story I remember when videotaping TRT response training for DOE was when Kevlar vests were first introduced. A vendor was demonstrating a vest to a group, and apparently never read his own training literature, as he invited somebody from the audience to stab him with a supplied tando knife. Needless to say, it penetrated, and the poor fellow bled to death before they got him out of the room. Apparently he was supposed to demonstrate the Kevlar's ability to resist the slashing motion of a knife, rather than a stabbing action. Sad, but true. Regards. Michaelson

Wow. Thanks for the info. That's very interesting.

I.J.

Rob · Post by **Rob** » Mon Aug 16, 2004 9:09 pm

I'm not sure if I'll offend anyone by saying this, however, the concept of a kevlar Indy jacket seems so wanky to me! What next? Kevlar undies to impress the ladies?

IndyBlues · Post by **IndyBlues** » Mon Aug 16, 2004 9:12 pm

Indiana Irwin wrote:I'm not sure if I'll offend anyone by saying this, however, the concept of a kevlar Indy jacket seems so wanky to me! What next? Kevlar undies to impress the ladies?

Well, for the average Joe, who may be a bit too paranoid, yeah, this is a goofy idea. But for an undercover, or plain clothes policeman, it may be a cool idea.

Rob · Post by **Rob** » Mon Aug 16, 2004 9:18 pm

Point taken, although I must say if I was working plain clothes and had to rely on armour in the jacket, rather than on my body (and there could be sound operational reasons for this), I might like a longer jacket!

IndyBlues · Post by **IndyBlues** » Mon Aug 16, 2004 9:30 pm

Very good point. Touche'

I'd rather a suit of armor nowadays.

Rob · Post by **Rob** » Mon Aug 16, 2004 10:01 pm

Or you could move down here

A lot of Americans I know who come to Sydney say that it's like San Francisco, or some other similar city in the 70s or early 80s insofar as its friendliness, crime rate and, to some degree, naivete in things. I think Rick McCallum (who does the SW movies with Uncle George) said a similar thing when they filmed Episodes II and III here. Having said that, our crime rate is increasing. I can remember a time when drive by shootings were considered newsworthy, moreso because "that sort of thing just doesn't happen here" than anything else. Now, of course, we have our share like anywhere else. Not as many automatic rifles and SMGs on the streets, however. That is one key difference. A lot of automatic handguns, however.

Bufflehead Jones · Post by **Bufflehead Jones** » Tue Aug 17, 2004 3:00 am

IJ,

Anytime I have seen a bullet hit kevlar, it bunches up around the point of impact. I think it has to do with the strength of the fibers and the multiple layers that help to stop the bullets. As the bullet hits the kevlar and begins to deform, the bullet is also spinning from the rifling in the barrel of the gun.

The kevlar only stops the penetration of the bullet. It can stop the bullet, but the person can still die from blunt trauma. It doesn't usually happen, but is within the realm of possibility. It will leave a nasty little bruise and maybe even some broken ribs.

With a knife or ice pick or any type of sharp edged weapon, the blade is capable of cutting through the material. The more of a stabbing type of motion rather than a slashing type of motion, the more likely it is to cut through the layers of the kevlar.

One funny note about kevlar, is that it was originally devealoped for automobile tires. It was invented by a chemist working for Dupont by the name of Stephanie Kwolek. It is 5 times stronger than steel and was to replace steel belted radial tires. It was during the 1970s and the gas crisis and Dupont was looking for a textile type of fiber that was light weight but strong. Steel wire is heavy. If they could find a fiber that was at least as strong as steel wire and was lighter in weight and was not affected by high temperatures, they could make belts on tires that would get better gas mileage. I often wondered what made the scientists angry enough to shoot at the tire to discover its ballistic properties.

The fiber is most famous for ballistic vests, but it is used along with other aramid fibers in countless products that we use today.

Post by **Michaelson** » Tue Aug 17, 2004 10:10 am

To clear things up, Sgt. Hack tells me that his biggest customers of this jacket has been the U.S.Military, as they've been requiring a jacket that doesn't 'target' them as military personnel, and the Indy style actually helps them blend in more with the 'crowd' when they're off duty, and yet still gives them Kevlar protection. They could care less about us 'impressing the ladies'. He only put it on the Wings site for any OTHER military or police personnel who may find such a garment of use.

This has only been posted HERE for folks who may be interested in something a bit, different, as it is a legitimate piece of 'Indygear', and offered by one of the only Lucasfilm licensed jacket makers. Operator Jake has been interested in a product like this for quite a while, but he's military, and that's understandable. Sgt. Hack has also told me the back log of orders for this jacket to the military by their family members as gifts for Christmas is unreal, so apparently this is why they decided to offer it in yet another leather style.

'goofy'?!

Sorry if this hit me wrong, but it did.

Regards. Michaelson

IndyBlues · Post by **IndyBlues** » Tue Aug 17, 2004 3:29 pm

Hey Michaeleson, I only stated that the idea would seem "goofy" to the average Joe, like a regular civilian. However, I also stated that it would probably be a good idea for the folks you mentioned above.
Just wanted to make sure you got my statement as intended.
'Blues

Post by **Michaelson** » Tue Aug 17, 2004 3:31 pm

I did after about 4 cups of coffee.

Regards. Michaelson

IndyBlues · Post by **IndyBlues** » Tue Aug 17, 2004 3:37 pm

I know what you mean. Being "de"caffienated in the morning can do some strange things to ya.

Gater · Post by **Gater** » Tue Aug 17, 2004 3:41 pm

What next? Kevlar undies to impress the ladies?

Don't make fun...if they made Kevlar Indy pants 10 yrs ago, I wouldn't limp when it rains!!

Post by **Michaelson** » Tue Aug 17, 2004 3:44 pm

Dare I ask?

No. I really don't want to know....

Regards. Michaelson

Swindiana · Post by **Swindiana** » Tue Aug 17, 2004 6:54 pm

Bufflehead explained it all I guess, but here are two links to a site that explains how stuff works in a great and easy manner and often with pictures and animations:

Soft body armour:
http://people.howstuffworks.com/body-armor2.htm

Blunt trauma (Animation of bullet hitting Kevlar, click 'Fire'):
http://people.howstuffworks.com/body-armor3.htm

Just thought I'd share.

Regards,
Swindiana

Rob · Post by **Rob** » Tue Aug 17, 2004 8:33 pm

Indiana Gater wrote:
What next? Kevlar undies to impress the ladies?
Don't make fun...if they made Kevlar Indy pants 10 yrs ago, I wouldn't limp when it rains!!

You didn't get shot in the ###, did you?