What Type Of Knot Is Indy Tie?

[Indyzane]

So I just received my Last Crusade tie by Magnoli Clothiers and it’s a beauty! So I’m just wondering what type of knot did Indy wear in the Last Crusade? Windsor? Half Windsor? Four in hand knot? Etc…..
Thanks for your help!

[Michaelson]

I'm a full Windsor man myself, so with that said, that's MY vote.

Regards! Michaelson

[kwad]

I myself only know one way to knot a tie and have no idea what it is called.
So I'm gonna say it's that one.

[Dalexs]

While I love the full windsor myself, I am partial to the four in hand becasue it makes for a very nice, small, controllable knot. Works great with thin vintage ties.

Here's some exampoles of each (I'm betting IJ's is a four in hand):

[Strider]

I am a fan of the full windsor myself, but I find that most modern ties are just not made fat enough to support the knot. However, I feel like the four in hand knot is more of a "regular guy" kind of knot. The half windsor is just plain ridiculous to try and tie. If it means anything to you, when I wear a tie for The Spirit and Indy, it's a four in hand. When I wear a tie to a formal dinner, it's a full windsor.

[afterthedog]

Dalexs:
THANK YOU for those illustrations!
The only knot I knew for sure was the half windsor, although I think I probably tied the four in hand a few times by accident while trying to figure out some other knots on my own.

[Strider]

Well, look at these pics:

"Me? Steal your wallet? No, no. That was Bink! Ugh, no one ever believes that one anymore!"
(Windsor on top, four in hand on bottom)


I think it's either a half windsor or a four in hand that Indy ties. If you look at the windsor, it's too fat to fit properly under my collar.

[Chewbacca Jones]

I never knew one not from another, except that the full Windsor was easy to spot because of it's fullness. Thanks to Dalexs, I have discovered that I only know how to tie a four-in-hand. Due to my long, "rounded" torso, I would probably need a "tall" tie to do anything other than the four-in-hand and half Windsor. I might play around though. I've never liked the uneven look of the four-in-hand. To sloppy for formal occasions.

[Indyzane]

Thanks all for your comments! Sounds like Four in Hand is the knot.

[Mattdeckard]

I'd have to vote four-in-hand. That knot is too narrow to look like a windsor.

Besides, anything else is too fussy for indy, and we all know James Bond only wears four-in-hands when he wears neckties instead of bowties, and Bond is his father.

[Michaelson]

I beg to differ, but I've also found that it depends entirely on the thickness of the material of the tie that also determines the 'fatness' of the knot.

I've tied full Windsor knots and had the perfect narrow triangle shape that matches the four-in-hand knot as depicted in Striders second photo. It's all in how tightly you work the knot, and how thick or thin the cloth is on the tie.

Regards! Michaelson

[Satipo]

I agree with Michaelson. It's all in the material. The fatness of my Windsor knots varies from tie to tie. However, with my vintage ties, because they tend to be shorter than my modern ones, I tend to go for a half-Windsor just to conserve a little length.

[maboot38]

I just tried the half windsor with my Magnoli officer's tie, and was able to get the knot to a comparable size. However, as the actual tie was Irish poplin, the material MIGHT have been more forgiving, making a full windsor possible.

I'm still thinking either half-windsor or four-in-hand.

As silly as it may be to even bother to need to know this for a fact, I bet this is one of those deals where the answer IS available. I don't know Harrison personally, not do I know how much of the Indy costume he was required to put on himself, but if I had to bet, my money would be on him tying his own tie. If you consider that, it is HIGHLY probably that during filming, he must have tied that tie almost a hundred times. It is possible that someone could ask Harrison this question and see what knot he was using at the time.

I'm not suggesting that someone actually ask him, as it seems a pretty silly thing to ask him. Even if he was a good friend, I doubt I'd bother him with such a thing. Just saying, I bet the answer IS out there.

[Mattdeckard]

He's the son of James Bond. It has to be a four-in-hand.

[Michaelson]

EXCELLENT point, Matt!

I remember tying full Windsors on ties back in the 70's with some of those gosh awful materials they sold at the time, making knots as big as your fist!

For a while there I started hand tying bow ties instead.

Regards! Michaelson

[tym]

I've always found that four-in-hand knots tend to come out asymmetrical, so I've always tied the half-Windsor (not at all hard to do with a bit of practice). For my ties, the full Windsor results in an obese knot.

[RCSignals]

Looking at screen shots, and the " V " shape and size of the knot, it appears to be a half-Windsor.

the 'four-in-hand' or 'military' knot is as tym says, asymmetrical.

[Strider]

The more I think about this, the more I am leaning toward half windsor. If you look at how far that tie rises up on his chest when his hands are up, it looks like my windsor photo. A four in hand knot tends to give the tie a lot more slack, and thus there is less "ride up" to it. In MD's photo, you can see what I think is the skinny end of the tie, and it's only about half the length of the wide end, which you just don't have with a four in hand. The skinny end is only slightly shorter than the wide end with a four in hand. A windsor and half windsor have much, much shorter skinny ends, so this is what's got me thinking half windsor, as the knot is just too narrow to be a full windsor. However, Michaelson is also right, I've tied full windsor knots that look like a four in hand, too.

[RCSignals]

The more I think about this, the more I am leaning toward half windsor. If you look at how far that tie rises up on his chest when his hands are up, it looks like my windsor photo. A four in hand knot tends to give the tie a lot more slack, and thus there is less "ride up" to it. In MD's photo, you can see what I think is the skinny end of the tie, and it's only about half the length of the wide end, which you just don't have with a four in hand. The skinny end is only slightly shorter than the wide end with a four in hand. A windsor and half windsor have much, much shorter skinny ends, so this is what's got me thinking half windsor, as the knot is just too narrow to be a full windsor. However, Michaelson is also right, I've tied full windsor knots that look like a four in hand, too.

The position of the 'skinny end' with a half-Windsor will vary depending on where along the tie the knot is placed. The Half-Windsor doesn't take up that much more length than a 'four-in-hand'.
But a 'Full-Windsor' that looks like a 'Four-in-Hand' ? Start over

[tym]

The more I think about this, the more I am leaning toward half windsor. If you look at how far that tie rises up on his chest when his hands are up, it looks like my windsor photo. A four in hand knot tends to give the tie a lot more slack, and thus there is less "ride up" to it. In MD's photo, you can see what I think is the skinny end of the tie, and it's only about half the length of the wide end, which you just don't have with a four in hand. The skinny end is only slightly shorter than the wide end with a four in hand. A windsor and half windsor have much, much shorter skinny ends, so this is what's got me thinking half windsor, as the knot is just too narrow to be a full windsor. However, Michaelson is also right, I've tied full windsor knots that look like a four in hand, too.

The position of the 'skinny end' with a half-Windsor will vary depending on where along the tie the knot is placed. The Half-Windsor doesn't take up that much more length than a 'four-in-hand'.
But a 'Full-Windsor' that looks like a 'Four-in-Hand' ? Start over

Agreed. It'll also depend on the length of the tie and the size of the person. I regularly have the skinny end only an inch or two shorter than the wide end when tying a half-Windsor.

[RCSignals]

Yes ideally the skinny end should be just about that much shorter.
Sometimes you can get or specify longer ties, especially good for those who like Full-Windsor knots.

[Indiana Jeff]

I'm not suggesting that someone actually ask him, as it seems a pretty silly thing to ask him. Even if he was a good friend, I doubt I'd bother him with such a thing. Just saying, I bet the answer IS out there.

No more silly than asking if he wore a cloth jacket while being chased by the Hovitos and that question has been asked. Not that I'm in the position to do the asking.

I wonder though about how often the tie would actually be tied during production. I think back to my Catholic school days where I would loosen the tie when I got home from school, slip it over my head and hang it on the door knob until the next morning. I think I went a couple of years without actually retying it. It would be much quicker and easier on continuity to have the tie slipped over HF's head and put aside until needed again.

Of course, we can't rule out clip on.

Regards,

Indiana Jeff

[Indy Magnoli]

Of course, we can't rule out clip on.

-Magnoli

[Indiana Jeff]

So you're saying we're not going to see this line-up in your catalog any time soon?



Regards,

Indiana Jeff

[gi_canuck]

I have one of these.. and they are awesome!! haha. Way better than a clip-on!!

[Dalexs]

In my opinion, based on the photo above (not including Striders... he's wearing a clip-on! )
you cannot in no way tell what kind of knot is tied.
So any speculation based on that is totally off base.

FIH and HW look too similar to make a call based on that photo.

I will try to grab a decent up close screen shot of it this weekend.

My thought is that they wouldn't be tying something like a HW in an action flick that would potentially
have to be retied over and over a number of times.

(But's just my opinion...)

Just found this for reference...

[Indyzane]

Well everyone I have tried both the Four In Hand & the Half Windsor and my conclusion is I think the Half Windsor look best IMO. I do like the small knot on the Four In Hand but the knot on th Half Windsor just looks better. But keep the comments coming this thread is fun! Love the zip tie!!!

[RCSignals]

In my opinion, based on the photo above (not including Striders... he's wearing a clip-on! )
you cannot in no way tell what kind of knot is tied.
So any speculation based on that is totally off base.

FIH and HW look too similar to make a call based on that photo.

I will try to grab a decent up close screen shot of it this weekend.

My thought is that they wouldn't be tying something like a HW in an action flick that would potentially
have to be retied over and over a number of times.

(But's just my opinion...)

Just found this for reference...

That's a horrible example of a Half-Windsor. Whoever tied it took a wrong turn.

I don't know how many times they'd have to re-tie a tie for a shoot, but they could just loosen it and slip it over the head if they had to.
Not that it's any more difficult to tie a half Windsor than a four-in-hand. Many of us can tie one before the guy with a clip on even gets his straight,

[RCSignals]

I have one of these.. and they are awesome!! haha. Way better than a clip-on!!

LOL Someone put a lot of work into that thing.

Just to avoid tying a tie

[Michaelson]

I thinking the same thing!

Regards! Michaelson

[Dalexs]

[That's a horrible example of a Half-Windsor. Whoever tied it took a wrong turn.

I don't know how many times they'd have to re-tie a tie for a shoot, but they could just loosen it and slip it over the head if they had to.

Yeah, sorry about that. I was looking fast during lunch. I guess, consider that how knot to tie a 1/2 windsor...
(get it, how knot... )

Anyways, like I promised...

Based on this I am now leaning more the 1/2 windsor as well...

And for comparison, a better example of 1/2 Windsor.

[Long John Tinfoil]

Although I've never tried to tie one, looking at that pic and then back up to the original set of diagrams I'm leaning towards the "Shell Knot".

LJ

[RCSignals]

Although I've never tried to tie one, looking at that pic and then back up to the original set of diagrams I'm leaning towards the "Shell Knot".

LJ

The shell knot has a similar result of a ' V' shape as the Half-Windsor but the Half-Windsor is more straight forward and much easier to tie.

[Indyzane]

Thanks Dalexs looks like a HW to me too! It doesn't really matter I guess, but now the great mystery is solved! Or is it?! Stay tuned folks will be right back with more!

[RCSignals]

[That's a horrible example of a Half-Windsor. Whoever tied it took a wrong turn.

I don't know how many times they'd have to re-tie a tie for a shoot, but they could just loosen it and slip it over the head if they had to.

Yeah, sorry about that. I was looking fast during lunch. I guess, consider that how knot to tie a 1/2 windsor...
(get it, how knot... )

Anyways, like I promised...

Based on this I am now leaning more the 1/2 windsor as well...

And for comparison, a better example of 1/2 Windsor.

Much better example of a Half-Windsor.

You can see the knot in the screen shot has been adjusted to remove the 'crease' and the knot tightened up (makes it 'neat') but certainly still looks like a Half Windsor.